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I think they have advantages but I do not think it is as much for being a "private" school as it is for being a school with families that have the means to focus on education and finding the absolute best opportuities for their children whether it be academics, athletics, or social.  There is one trait they all have and that is a Catholic education and for the most part a family that is involved in the Catholic church.  That is their community.

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2 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Catholic didn;t beat my team. I'm just biased towards a level playing field for public schools. 

Btango I'm fully aware Catholic is not like the Catholic schools they play. I'm saying they are more similar to those typ of schools/private schools than they are public schools they compete against. When Catholic guys say they have no built in advantages by being a private school competing in a public school league they are being disingenuous. Just the sheer facts of controlled numbers gives them an advantage, before we even talk about boundaries, and the elective process to get in. They work hard and have a great program,. but dont overlook these advantages. 

Work Weddington is an anomaly. Now add in all other public school games and Catholic's win percentage is likely close to 98%. When was the last time they lost a conference game before this? I'll hang up and listen.

Are you accusing Catholic of controlling their enrollment to stay in 3A or keep at a certain level? Where was that control when they had nearly 1500 students and moved to 4A? Also there is no elective process to getting into Catholic, none at all. 

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3 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Catholic didn;t beat my team. I'm just biased towards a level playing field for public schools. 

Surely you can't think all public schools have an equal playing field? Yes the geographic area catholic draws from is different than a "traditional" public school district. Yes they have a different entrance requirements and it can be cost prohibitive. All these things you mention actually lessen the ability and chance of getting elite level athletes. It also creates a situation where scrutiny of the program is high and they compensate for that by having the strictest transfer policy in the state.

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No; Catholic never accused Catholic of controlling any numbers. Just noting that its an advantage by being able to be selective in the entrance requirements and the type of student you receive. Public schools get who they get and have no right of refusal. if you live in the boundary area you can attend. A general student even if he wishes to pay the tuition and get a Charlotte Catholic education can not just move into the Catholic "boundary" . At Catholic you must take a placement test  and your application is reviewed. Thus a selection process to control who/type of student it receives. Public Schools don't have this option. This is a distinct advantage.  Just like when it was discussed about putting them into the NCISAA  folks over there didn;t want them.

 

Paul, Catholic is the epitome of a great high school program. But they are a private parochial school by definition. To even compare or have them competing against public schools is unfair. A feeder middle school, no attendance boundary,. Cardinal Gibbons shouldn;t play with public schools either. 

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They have advantages and they have disadvantages. Similar to a lot of other schools. Winning programs attract great players. It's the reason kids want to play for MC, Wake Forest, East Forsyth, etc... 

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7 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

No; Catholic never accused Catholic of controlling any numbers. Just noting that its an advantage by being able to be selective in the entrance requirements and the type of student you receive. Public schools get who they get and have no right of refusal. if you live in the boundary area you can attend. A general student even if he wishes to pay the tuition and get a Charlotte Catholic education can not just move into the Catholic "boundary" . At Catholic you must take a placement test  and your application is reviewed. Thus a selection process to control who/type of student it receives. Public Schools don't have this option. This is a distinct advantage.  Just like when it was discussed about putting them into the NCISAA  folks over there didn;t want them.

 

Paul, Catholic is the epitome of a great high school program. But they are a private parochial school by definition. To even compare or have them competing against public schools is unfair. A feeder middle school, no attendance boundary,. Cardinal Gibbons shouldn;t play with public schools either. 

Public schools " getting who they get" has long ago been over. As it relates to sports there are no boundaries and you are well aware.

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7 hours ago, SPRaiders78 said:

Y'all keep it going. I'll come back next off season and stir it up again.  I got my free education from Mr. Catholic last off season.  NEXT!!!!!

Tried to put a gif of someone raising a glass, but it didn't work. 

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17 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

At Catholic you must take a placement test  and your application is reviewed. Thus a selection process to control who/type of student it receives. Public Schools don't have this option. This is a distinct advantage. 

 A feeder middle school

Again a placement test actually hurts the enrollment, unless your saying there are different tests.

Also, about every school in NC has a feeder middle school.

Yes there are advantages to attending Catholic but D1 athletes are not flocking there like they are at charter schools.

I understand they are one of, if not, the best Programs in the state and I would want my son to play there even though I am not Catholic. The cost and having to move Charlotte would be impossible for me. Just like it is for the vast majority of parents.

 

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4 hours ago, Paul Graham said:

Again a placement test actually hurts the enrollment, unless your saying there are different tests.

Also, about every school in NC has a feeder middle school.

Yes there are advantages to attending Catholic but D1 athletes are not flocking there like they are at charter schools.

I understand they are one of, if not, the best Programs in the state and I would want my son to play there even though I am not Catholic. The cost and having to move Charlotte would be impossible for me. Just like it is for the vast majority of parents.

 

Schools like CC don't bother me. I know they are going to be held accountable. Schools like IMG in FL do. I see Charter Schools of the future becoming a problem in athletics in general because Charter Schools are a part of the NCPS system and are therefore entitled to be a part of all activities. Their students can come from anywhere in the LEA. They can say they are applying to be a student but the reality that are applying to be an athlete. A successful athletic program would therefore be a selling point for the school itself. 

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Paul I guess you are missing the point. Placement test are a "selective qualitative" measure to ensure only a certain type of student attends regardless of whether they meet teh other qualifications. Placement test help strengthen a product much more than it restricts. 

2nd most public high schools share feeder middle schools, and the feeder middle is not always academically similar to the feeder high school.  In CC case the feeder middle school Holy Trinity is almost identical in teh type of student, academics, enrollment process, and guess what they are pretty good at football too. Have you seen their facilities vs. other Middle schools?  They routinely beat UC schools. But you are right no advantage. Take 2018 Ranson Middle football team. Probably one of the best Middle school/jr. high teams ever in Charlotte. Those players went to Vance, West Charlotte, North, and Mallard Creek. Now take Holy Trinity and their top players. The vast majority ended up at Catholic. Had all those Vance guys gone to the same highschool they could have changed a program over night. 

Catholic is one of the best highschool programs in America. Hard working and dedicated. But we cant simply over look that they are a private playing with public schools. This debate has been talked about in FL, NY and many metro areas.  

 

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I understand how placement tests work since I spent several years in the Community College system. But to say that those tests have that sort of impact on athletics is simply not true.  If your searching for a singular cohort of students then these tests work wonders. Yes, simply, you can control who attends through selective testing. But Catholic is too good academically and athletically for a single test. 

Most mountain counties, with a couple exceptions, have single destination middle schools. Not everyone in the state does it like the major metro areas. I understand that it is a population and economics issues. I agree that if these metro area middles school sent those kinds to a single high school it would create significantly better teams there. 

CC's middle school is good because that system is in place as it should be.

I just don't see any of this as an advantage, of any note, especially in regards to athletics. I still say charter, magnet and open enrollment is a significantly greater advantage than Catholic has.

  

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50 minutes ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Paul I guess you are missing the point. Placement test are a "selective qualitative" measure to ensure only a certain type of student attends regardless of whether they meet teh other qualifications. Placement test help strengthen a product much more than it restricts. 

2nd most public high schools share feeder middle schools, and the feeder middle is not always academically similar to the feeder high school.  In CC case the feeder middle school Holy Trinity is almost identical in teh type of student, academics, enrollment process, and guess what they are pretty good at football too. Have you seen their facilities vs. other Middle schools?  They routinely beat UC schools. But you are right no advantage. Take 2018 Ranson Middle football team. Probably one of the best Middle school/jr. high teams ever in Charlotte. Those players went to Vance, West Charlotte, North, and Mallard Creek. Now take Holy Trinity and their top players. The vast majority ended up at Catholic. Had all those Vance guys gone to the same highschool they could have changed a program over night. 

Catholic is one of the best highschool programs in America. Hard working and dedicated. But we cant simply over look that they are a private playing with public schools. This debate has been talked about in FL, NY and many metro areas.  

 

Catholic's middle school facilities aren't anything to send postcards home about. Until about maybe four years ago the original CC stadium was still there, crumbling. They replaced it, but field is ok I would guess. The gym is ok, it is virtually the same as when CC used it in the 1970s-1990s, except newer seating. None of the middle school facilities athletics wise are anything special, at least in my eyes. There is also no track, tennis courts or softball/baseball facilities on the campus of either HT or CC. All UC middle schools play their football games at their feeder HS, which I believe almost everyone from Weddington MS goes to Weddington HS so that is an advantage for them too is it not? I think the amount of kids in UC going to different HS' from their middle school is slim unless they redistrict which they have in the past. 

Most students at HT are similar because they are younger siblings of current or former CC students. There are tons of second generation and now third generation Cougars at the HS/school system. Heck there are kids who had siblings that graduated in 2008 and are at the HS. 

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2 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Paul I guess you are missing the point. Placement test are a "selective qualitative" measure to ensure only a certain type of student attends regardless of whether they meet teh other qualifications. Placement test help strengthen a product much more than it restricts. 

2nd most public high schools share feeder middle schools, and the feeder middle is not always academically similar to the feeder high school.  In CC case the feeder middle school Holy Trinity is almost identical in teh type of student, academics, enrollment process, and guess what they are pretty good at football too. Have you seen their facilities vs. other Middle schools?  They routinely beat UC schools. But you are right no advantage. Take 2018 Ranson Middle football team. Probably one of the best Middle school/jr. high teams ever in Charlotte. Those players went to Vance, West Charlotte, North, and Mallard Creek. Now take Holy Trinity and their top players. The vast majority ended up at Catholic. Had all those Vance guys gone to the same highschool they could have changed a program over night. 

Catholic is one of the best highschool programs in America. Hard working and dedicated. But we cant simply over look that they are a private playing with public schools. This debate has been talked about in FL, NY and many metro areas.  

 

I have been at 8 different high schools and I have never been at one that shared middle schools. Every HS I have even been at allows their MS to use their FB stadium to play their games at. I have never been in the CM system or the Raleigh (Wake County) area system.

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2 hours ago, Glenn said:

I have been at 8 different high schools and I have never been at one that shared middle schools. Every HS I have even been at allows their MS to use their FB stadium to play their games at. I have never been in the CM system or the Raleigh (Wake County) area system.

In his defense they do. For instance in Winston Salem/Forsyth County a kid going to lets say Walkertown Middle School could possibly go to Carver, Walkertown, East Forsyth, and maybe North Forsyth. So they do have to share the kids. But I don't believe middle school football is a thing in Forsyth County. 

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5 hours ago, forsythco said:

In his defense they do. For instance in Winston Salem/Forsyth County a kid going to lets say Walkertown Middle School could possibly go to Carver, Walkertown, East Forsyth, and maybe North Forsyth. So they do have to share the kids. But I don't believe middle school football is a thing in Forsyth County. 

At one time WS/FC did away with all MS athletics. I understand that they did add basketball, baseball, basketball, eytc. back in but not FB. Is that correct? 

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1 hour ago, Glenn said:

At one time WS/FC did away with all MS athletics. I understand that they did add basketball, baseball, basketball, eytc. back in but not FB. Is that correct? 

Yes sir. I really wish they did add middle school football back though. Pop Warner (or whatever they're calling it now) has always felt so disjointed to me. 

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19 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Paul I guess you are missing the point. Placement test are a "selective qualitative" measure to ensure only a certain type of student attends regardless of whether they meet teh other qualifications. Placement test help strengthen a product much more than it restricts. 

2nd most public high schools share feeder middle schools, and the feeder middle is not always academically similar to the feeder high school.  In CC case the feeder middle school Holy Trinity is almost identical in teh type of student, academics, enrollment process, and guess what they are pretty good at football too. Have you seen their facilities vs. other Middle schools?  They routinely beat UC schools. But you are right no advantage. Take 2018 Ranson Middle football team. Probably one of the best Middle school/jr. high teams ever in Charlotte. Those players went to Vance, West Charlotte, North, and Mallard Creek. Now take Holy Trinity and their top players. The vast majority ended up at Catholic. Had all those Vance guys gone to the same highschool they could have changed a program over night.  

Catholic is one of the best highschool programs in America. Hard working and dedicated. But we cant simply over look that they are a private playing with public schools. This debate has been talked about in FL, NY and many metro areas.  

 

It's evident you're not familiar with middle schools in Charlotte. The majority of middle school students all go to one school. In regards to your statement about Ransom Middle school. I'm thinking you just don't know. Very few kids from Ransom attend Vance or Mallard Creek. You might have 2 or 3. I wouldn't call that sharing. James Martin Middle School went undefeated for 9 years.. 97% of those kids attend Vance, which is 50 yards away.  Their program did not change over night. They have a weight room, that would put most High Schools to shame.  MC kids feeder program is Ridge Road, North Meck feeder school is Alexander Middle, Bailey Road Middle is feeder for Hough. Piedmont IB Middle School kids are from all areas of Charlotte. Their kids go everywhere.

CC has no advantage because they're private. Great coaching and they do a great job of combining their middle school (Feeder)  and High School together, which numerous programs throughout Charlotte can do. They very seldom get elite players like the public schools. Public schools have changed dramatically the last few years. More parents are just packing up and moving to the district, of school of choice. It's like a high school football portal. 

Vance QB previous school South Meck

MC QB previous school Northwestern

West Charlotte QB previous school Hickory Ridge

Myers Park QB previous school Hough

Hough QB previous school Clayton.

Hopewell QB previous school Charlotte Christian

Public schools can get any kid that's willing to move, CC cannot. Advantage Public.

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J-Heat 110, your comment that most high schools share feeder schools is not true from what I have seen. The vast majority of schools I have seen have one or two middle schools (most have one) that feed a specific HS. Forsyth County (unless they have changed in the last few years) has open enrollment in which their students can go anywhere as long as they provide transportation.

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Hearing about a possible scrimmage for Catholic.  Don't know if it is finalized yet so I won't say who, but if it happens (even with it just being a scrim) get your popcorn ready.

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I’ll say it.... KM asked Catholic if they would be interested in coming to the Cleveland Co Jamboree to play KM.  Of course that has to go through Crest since they are the host school.     I told Catholic that a month ago.   Tremendous respect between the two staffs.   What better way to get your kids ready for the season than to prep for Catholic?   

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1 hour ago, btango said:

I doubt Catholic has any issue getting quality scrimmage opponents from the county.

Was told Catholic is in the Cleveland County Jamboree. Also AC Reynolds.  Could shape up to be one of the best scrimmages around this year.

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2 hours ago, smashmouth5 said:

Was told Catholic is in the Cleveland County Jamboree. Also AC Reynolds.  Could shape up to be one of the best scrimmages around this year.

Scrimmages? Mean absolutely nothing outside of getting your guys ready for the season, and working on stuff. CC  during the Indy elite days would hold their on with them @ scrimmages.  Real game, I'm thinking a beat down.

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1 hour ago, work7 said:

Scrimmages? Mean absolutely nothing outside of getting your guys ready for the season, and working on stuff. CC  during the Indy elite days would hold their on with them @ scrimmages.  Real game, I'm thinking a beat down.

Doesn't mean a thing to the regular season, but when you get the right teams together it makes for a great gate and atmosphere for a group of fans, who by this point, are craving football. We in Cleveland County just enjoy seeing our young men battle on the field.

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Work I'm very familiar with CMS, and James Martin was built in the governors village so yes they would all go to Vance as that's the way it was set up in 1997. They are practically one large campus. So to use James Martin as an example is disingenuous to  your argument. Ranson had top players go to many different high schools.  Also James Martin did have a super long streak. Now factor in they were the largest middle school in the state with nearly 2000 students at one point vs. most middle schools with a 3rd of that. Then factor in their weak conference, being in the university area, their student assignment area, and the make up of the student body its easy to see how they could that long winning with good coaching. They had superior talent. NOw that James martin enrollment has dropped how are they doing?

The point is Catholic gets all of the top Holy Trinity players, whereas in public schools its spread out with no high school getting all of a certain middle school except in cases where the schools are on one campus like Martin/Vance. In most counties middle schools feed various high schools not just one. 

2nd you list QBs that transfer from other areas in the county. Catholic nor private schools have no boundaries in mecklenburg county. They have no competition of other large private schools to choose from. ST Gabriel doesn;t have football, CTK is a start up to put it nicely. So if one school can corner the market on a certain type of player they have an advantage. The same thing at Cardinal Gibbons. You get a monopoly on the market. 

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15 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Work I'm very familiar with CMS, and James Martin was built in the governors village so yes they would all go to Vance as that's the way it was set up in 1997. They are practically one large campus. So to use James Martin as an example is disingenuous to  your argument. Ranson had top players go to many different high schools.  Also James Martin did have a super long streak. Now factor in they were the largest middle school in the state with nearly 2000 students at one point vs. most middle schools with a 3rd of that. Then factor in their weak conference, being in the university area, their student assignment area, and the make up of the student body its easy to see how they could that long winning with good coaching. They had superior talent. NOw that James martin enrollment has dropped how are they doing?

The point is Catholic gets all of the top Holy Trinity players, whereas in public schools its spread out with no high school getting all of a certain middle school except in cases where the schools are on one campus like Martin/Vance. In most counties middle schools feed various high schools not just one. 

2nd you list QBs that transfer from other areas in the county. Catholic nor private schools have no boundaries in mecklenburg county. They have no competition of other large private schools to choose from. ST Gabriel doesn;t have football, CTK is a start up to put it nicely. So if one school can corner the market on a certain type of player they have an advantage. The same thing at Cardinal Gibbons. You get a monopoly on the market. 

Once James Martin AD & Football coached retired (Ricky Clark). Things immediately started changing when he left the program. It had absolutely nothing to do with enrollment. The numbers have not changed with the student participation. Coaching and mentoring on the field and the classroom, had a lot to do with their success. I was on  staff for 6 of those years and  the players were nothing to brag about.  It took a village. I spent numerous days taking kids home to empty houses, single parent homes, and paid numerous pay to play fees. A very difficult program to coach.  To suggest that enrollment,  and alleged weak conference was the reason for their success, just confirms you've never step foot  on campus. Their success was based off the system he ran. Very strict and discipline and well organized and very structured. I also used Ridge Road, Alexander, Bailey Road, and i left out MLK as examples of schools that are feeder schools. So when you say they don't predominantly feed into one school. That's just not true. There might be 2 or 3 players from Ransom on Vance roster, and there are zero on Mallard Creek. 

In regards to Catholic out recruiting and getting these certain type of players, and stud athletes because of boundaries. I just don't see it. Very few of those kids play football after high school. They just have a well oiled machine of a system. I also don't believe you're familiar with the number of kids that are just packing up and moving into districts of choice, within the public school system. CC has no advantage over public. That's just a hard sale for me to suggest they have an advantage.    

 

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On 1/18/2020 at 12:31 AM, Glenn said:

At one time WS/FC did away with all MS athletics. I understand that they did add basketball, baseball, basketball, eytc. back in but not FB. Is that correct? 

Not sure about now but football season slot was boys volleyball. Not much chance at football being added now with cost of equipment high and concussion concerns.

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3 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

whereas in public schools its spread out with no high school getting all of a certain middle school except in cases where the schools are on one campus like Martin/Vance. In most counties middle schools feed various high schools not just one. 

2nd you list QBs that transfer from other areas in the county. Catholic nor private schools have no boundaries in mecklenburg county. They have no competition of other large private schools to choose from. 

Most counties have middle schools that district directly with a high school including Meck County.

One reason you see players from one middle school team e ding up at several high schools is because they look fir the school / team that is best for them.  
 

If Catholic has issues at QB they are not getting a transfer from a local private or public to step in for the next season.  They would be required to sit out 365 days.

Some of your arguments just do not work.

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15 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Work I'm very familiar with CMS, and James Martin was built in the governors village so yes they would all go to Vance as that's the way it was set up in 1997. They are practically one large campus. So to use James Martin as an example is disingenuous to  your argument. Ranson had top players go to many different high schools.  Also James Martin did have a super long streak. Now factor in they were the largest middle school in the state with nearly 2000 students at one point vs. most middle schools with a 3rd of that. Then factor in their weak conference, being in the university area, their student assignment area, and the make up of the student body its easy to see how they could that long winning with good coaching. They had superior talent. NOw that James martin enrollment has dropped how are they doing?

The point is Catholic gets all of the top Holy Trinity players, whereas in public schools its spread out with no high school getting all of a certain middle school except in cases where the schools are on one campus like Martin/Vance. In most counties middle schools feed various high schools not just one. 

2nd you list QBs that transfer from other areas in the county. Catholic nor private schools have no boundaries in mecklenburg county. They have no competition of other large private schools to choose from. ST Gabriel doesn;t have football, CTK is a start up to put it nicely. So if one school can corner the market on a certain type of player they have an advantage. The same thing at Cardinal Gibbons. You get a monopoly on the market. 

A couple of things. You brought up St. Gabe’s, a fine school, but an elementary school. CTK I believe started football too early, but that’s neither here not there. 
We get almost every kid from Holy Trinity not just athlete because almost all have been in Catholic school since Pre-K. I was a Catholic school student my entire grade school life as were a vast majority of my classmates according to a survey done my senior year by the school newspaper. That means Pre-K through 12 in Catholic school. 
While you have strong feelings on this you do seem to have gaps in your knowledge when it comes to how we operate. 

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Work7, come on man. I've been to James Martin more than any other middle school in Charlotte. LOL. They have loads of talent. The Majority of Vance star players were stars at James Martin at one point. They were VERY talented. Did they have excellent coaching? Yes they did. DId having a very high enrollment and player availability help? It sure did. YOu cant just look at the disadvantages, and not state teh obvious advantages James Martin had. Just like Catholic. You cant just look at the disadvantages and not look at teh distinct advantages CAtholic has, 

Btango, Catholic. The point is they have a dedicated feeder system from a middle school with no other competition or options for those students if they want a Catholic education. This is a distinct advantage. I'd never expect a transfer QB to go to Catholic because of the system they run. Its not QB friendly. Getting palyers that fit you system and that are familiar with the school from ages 5 on up is an incredible advantage. NO residency boundary= advantage, no competition = Advantage, controlled enrollment =advantage, no low income students= advantage., 

 

In the rankings of best sports schools in NC what are the top 2 schools? Cardinal Gibbons and Charlotte Catholic. Coincidence? NO. 92% of Charlotte Catholic students attend a 4 year university after graduation vs. 30% in most public schools. AVg, medican income 72k vs. 27k in most public schools. You are right its no advantage. When you click on similar schools to Charlotte Catholic you know what comes up? Charlotte Latin, Davidson Day, Providence Day, and Country Day. Hmmmmmmm. 

 

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46 minutes ago, J-Heat1110 said:

Work7, come on man. I've been to James Martin more than any other middle school in Charlotte. LOL. They have loads of talent. The Majority of Vance star players were stars at James Martin at one point. They were VERY talented. Did they have excellent coaching? Yes they did. DId having a very high enrollment and player availability help? It sure did. YOu cant just look at the disadvantages, and not state teh obvious advantages James Martin had. Just like Catholic. You cant just look at the disadvantages and not look at teh distinct advantages CAtholic has, 

Btango, Catholic. The point is they have a dedicated feeder system from a middle school with no other competition or options for those students if they want a Catholic education. This is a distinct advantage. I'd never expect a transfer QB to go to Catholic because of the system they run. Its not QB friendly. Getting palyers that fit you system and that are familiar with the school from ages 5 on up is an incredible advantage. NO residency boundary= advantage, no competition = Advantage, controlled enrollment =advantage, no low income students= advantage., 

 

In the rankings of best sports schools in NC what are the top 2 schools? Cardinal Gibbons and Charlotte Catholic. Coincidence? NO. 92% of Charlotte Catholic students attend a 4 year university after graduation vs. 30% in most public schools. AVg, medican income 72k vs. 27k in most public schools. You are right its no advantage. When you click on similar schools to Charlotte Catholic you know what comes up? Charlotte Latin, Davidson Day, Providence Day, and Country Day. Hmmmmmmm. 

 

"Controlled enrollment" is somewhat of a fallacy.  They are not turning students away.  "Residency Bounday" is not so much in play in 2020 in urban areas.  Look at the movement of players.  "Competition" would be the four other privates within a six mile drive plus publics especially AK and Providence.  "Low income" students is bad for the football program?

The reason CG and CC are going to rank high in best sports schools is much more to do with the Olympic / Country Club sports than football.  CG has more advantage than CC because there is much less private school competition for the students in their geographical area.  Also, Gibbons has seen their athletic dominance drop off since moving up to 4A.

I guarantee you the median household income at the Big Four privates dwarfs Charlotte Catholic's.

I have never written they do not have some advantages but the ones you initially metnioned and have touted in the past are not the ones that make the difference in my opinion.  You have started to expand your argument though.

I have seen several games against very good public schools that Catholic should not have won.  Vance twice comes to mind.  It was not athleticism or really even the scheme but fundamentals and not making minimal mistakes in a pressure situation.

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20 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

In most counties middle schools feed various high schools not just one. 

You are loosely basing what you think goes on in CMS to the entire state. In the west the middle schools feed the High School, period. For example, Haywood County. IT has Waynesville Middle that goes to Tuscola and Canton Middle that goes to Pisgah. Jackson County has each of its Middle Schools going to Smoky Mountain (they have K-8 schools here). Same in Transylvania, Buncombe, Asheville City, Macon, Henderson, Hendersonville City, Clay, Cherokee, Yancey, Graham, Avery, Mitchell...etc. On the Coast it is the same way.

18 hours ago, work7 said:

In regards to Catholic out recruiting and getting these certain type of players, and stud athletes because of boundaries. I just don't see it. Very few of those kids play football after high school.

If you think Catholic is recruiting players to build their program you need to spend some actual time at Catholic. I used to think they or "friends of the program" recruited until I spent some time with Catholic. They are not recruiting, period. They are good because when you start a kid in the program in youth ball and they get the same plays, technique, drills, philosophy, ties to the program they are simply better prepared when they get to middle and high school. You can look at example all over the state at how this works. Swain County, Murphy and Robbinsville, Tarboro are great examples in 1A. Call Bobby Poss (former ACR head man) and he will tell you that he turned Reynolds into what it is today by starting with the little one in youth. Everyone is on the same page of the same book.

Their academic requirements do not fit a team building a football legacy. Their transfer requirements are punitive to transferring in to play there. I think you are discounting the type of kids that go there. 

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So Btango, Catholic gets a benefit from Olympic sports, but not football? The myth that Charlotte Catholic, CG, dont get good players is a fallacy. Players move no doubt, but the residency lines are not an entire county which boundaries do not move. So player A in northern Charlotte doesn't have to "move" to meet a boundary. Student A cant "move" into CC district for their good academics. It is a controlled enrollment because the other privates don't specialize in being Catholic, and the general student can't just move into the CC district like you can MC, Vance, AK or any other public school and be eligible to participate because its a private school by definition. meaning  enrollment is restricted to whom they choose to enroll be it  via testing , catholic or whatever criteria they use. This is an advantage. The more like minded students they have the more efficient they become. This is the basis of private school education to eliminate weak performers or those that would slow the group down. The Gideon Approach.

Paul, I never mentioned recruiting in any aspect of CC, and never accused them of doing so. Never have and never will as I have nothing personal against them. Its a private vs. public debate for me. Public schools have many difficulties that privates just don't have. Moonlighting against public schools in sports it just cherry picking the better aspects of public sports w/o the difficulties that public schools face. Lets do some comparisons. 

Bishop McGuiness State titles Boys basketball 1963,82,87,09,19 cross country 2011, 2012, 2013 tennis 2011 girls basketball 9 state championships  with an enrollment of around 300 students. 

Charlotte Catholic womens swimming 15+ state championships, Mens swimming 05, 08 Lacrosse 2010,2011, 08,09 and counting. basketball 16,  

Football 77,81,84,04,05,14,15,17,18,19 ships while completely dominating public school competition winning last 4 of 5. 

Cardinal Gibbons Cross country 06,11,12,14, girls cross country 05,06,07,08,10,11,12,13,14,15,16, soccer 06,08,10,11,14 girls soccer 07,13. volleyball 05,06,07,09,10,11,12,13,14,15

Tennis 06,07,08,09,11,12,13,14, 

So I'm to believe that the three private schools winning state championships at an alarming rate in a majority of the sports is only because they work so much harder than public schools? That its no advantage to have a certain demographic and no district boundaries? Then I'm to believe these same athletes that win so much, are no factor on the football field and give no advantage? Again the #1, and #2 composite sports teams in the state are Cardinal Gibbons and then Charlotte Catholic. So spare me they dont have athletes or look different getting off the bus. The records speak for itself. Three schools winning at an absurb clip in just about every sport they participate in, but you are right no advantage being a private in a public league.

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4 hours ago, J-Heat1110 said:

So Btango, Catholic gets a benefit from Olympic sports, but not football? The myth that Charlotte Catholic, CG, dont get good players is a fallacy. Players move no doubt, but the residency lines are not an entire county which boundaries do not move. So player A in northern Charlotte doesn't have to "move" to meet a boundary. Student A cant "move" into CC district for their good academics. It is a controlled enrollment because the other privates don't specialize in being Catholic, and the general student can't just move into the CC district like you can MC, Vance, AK or any other public school and be eligible to participate because its a private school by definition. meaning  enrollment is restricted to whom they choose to enroll be it  via testing , catholic or whatever criteria they use. This is an advantage. The more like minded students they have the more efficient they become. This is the basis of private school education to eliminate weak performers or those that would slow the group down. The Gideon Approach.

Paul, I never mentioned recruiting in any aspect of CC, and never accused them of doing so. Never have and never will as I have nothing personal against them. Its a private vs. public debate for me. Public schools have many difficulties that privates just don't have. Moonlighting against public schools in sports it just cherry picking the better aspects of public sports w/o the difficulties that public schools face. Lets do some comparisons. 

Bishop McGuiness State titles Boys basketball 1963,82,87,09,19 cross country 2011, 2012, 2013 tennis 2011 girls basketball 9 state championships  with an enrollment of around 300 students. 

Charlotte Catholic womens swimming 15+ state championships, Mens swimming 05, 08 Lacrosse 2010,2011, 08,09 and counting. basketball 16,  

Football 77,81,84,04,05,14,15,17,18,19 ships while completely dominating public school competition winning last 4 of 5. 

Cardinal Gibbons Cross country 06,11,12,14, girls cross country 05,06,07,08,10,11,12,13,14,15,16, soccer 06,08,10,11,14 girls soccer 07,13. volleyball 05,06,07,09,10,11,12,13,14,15

Tennis 06,07,08,09,11,12,13,14, 

So I'm to believe that the three private schools winning state championships at an alarming rate in a majority of the sports is only because they work so much harder than public schools? That its no advantage to have a certain demographic and no district boundaries? Then I'm to believe these same athletes that win so much, are no factor on the football field and give no advantage? Again the #1, and #2 composite sports teams in the state are Cardinal Gibbons and then Charlotte Catholic. So spare me they dont have athletes or look different getting off the bus. The records speak for itself. Three schools winning at an absurb clip in just about every sport they participate in, but you are right no advantage being a private in a public league.

You got a few years wrong with Catholic. No lacrosse titles in 2010 or 11. Did win in 2014. No football title in 2014. 1981/84 titles were D II Western titles. Some consider them real titles, others don’t. There are no banners for them at Catholic. 

You ever thought the great coaching goes into it? For example Catholic has three peated in women’s tennis. Their coach is Jo Cabana. She’s won 26 state titles over her career coaching boys and girls in FL and NC. Won I think 8 or 9 titles at Catholic. Without her doubt CC wins a majority of those. 
 

Same can be said for swimming, football, etc. Coaching matters. Not to mention there is great middle school football at HT. Many forget Porter Rooks went to HT but PDS offered him free school which we couldn’t so he went there. It all starts at Holy Trinity though.

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